~Needs & Wants~
On Twitter today, there was a kink question of the day posted about "is it disobedience if a submissive refuses to do something based off of moral or ethical reasoning." The question, and some of the subsequent discussion got me thinking about the whole topic in general and I figured I might as well subject others to my thoughts too...
Needs and wants, everyone has them, and they all are valid, but being valid does not equal being safe, sane, smart, or attainable. I mean, I want to be a six foot, well endowed, multi-millionaire--- and if I win the lottery, I might get one of those things...
I hear all too often, some WannaDomaBe making the declaration to a submissive that "your needs are not important, MY needs will be your needs," and unfortunately, I have known a few subs that have gone off with someone like that, and had it end badly.
Our needs are ours and can never be totally relegated to the side without causing great amounts of stress and drama. Sometimes this stays internal and becomes depression, anger, resentment, low self-esteem, etc... or outward in fighting, drama, disobedience, etc...
Needs and wants are internal creations, someone else cannot dictate to a person what their needs and wants should be. Through enough discussion, browbeating or manipulation, a person can change their needs and wants for someone else, but unless it is a true shift, it will not last, and that person's needs are going to push back through.
I do not understand this attitude of picking any person and deciding that you want them to be your sub, and that you can twist and conform them to what you want. Personally, I have to take time to get to know the person, to see what their needs and wants are, and see how closely they match or are compatible to mine. Through this discussion and growth process, I have found people that have the want to see to my needs without subsuming the submissive's needs.
Needs and wants can at times run contrary to themselves as well. I have the need to remain healthy, I have the want to have unprotected sex because it is a lot more fun. In this case, the need outweighs the want, and I have protected sex. I use this example because I have heard many different subs talk about how a Dom does not want to have protected sex even though the submissive does, and that the submissive (at times) gets manipulated through that element of "My needs are yours" and "a good submissive does what they are told" and other bullshit. Even if the submissive wants to have good ol' bareback sex too, their need (and potential limit) of protected sex should be respected.
Another need element that I have come across is the need of time and attention. I know this is a big one for Poly people too... right now, I have a lot on my plate, both in the sense of everyday life, but also when it comes to play, I have a few different people that I play with. One thing that I discuss right up front is this element of not setting a specific schedule, not knowing how much time there is going to be for play etc, because short of finding someone with that spark, I know that play relationships end up taking a backseat when other life issues come up. If the person that I am talking to needs more than that, it is not going to work, for either of us, and I would rather not get started down that road to drama.
Touching back to the personal ethic/moral issue, and having read someone discuss the element of photos, the Dom wanting them and the sub not wanting them to be taken...
This is an area that I have had lots of experience with as I like photos, I have been asked why I want them, and I have realized that they are sort of like souvenirs of that play. I do like sharing them to some degree, but it is not so much about tossing them out there to say "Look what I did," as it is that visual element that I can go back and relive (and sometimes wank to) the moment. I have played with people that were total camera whores and loved it, to those that were of the 'no way no how' element. What it has come down to for me is, that it is not my body, reputation and livelihood that is at 'risk' with these pictures. I know, and play with a number of professional people that if it were know in the least that they were kinky, it could easily jeopardize their jobs. No matter how careful I am in handling the photos, shit happens... my computer could go in for repairs and the tech gets nosy, hell someone could steal it and for the fun of it start posting them. Hell, I had a friend who had a relative use their computer to send an email, found personal photos, and then tried to blackmail them... so shit does happen, and if a person does not want to run that risk (And yes, that is risk aware) then it doesn't happen. Now, that being said, I have discussed with individuals if there were anyway to make them feel safe, and me still get pics, and there have been some yeses, and some nos. and it is all good...
So ultimately, to answer the question, if the submissive has personal moral or ethical reasons for not wanting to do something, then no, it is not disobedient, and I would say that if whatever the "X" item that caused the contention is a major want/need for me... I need to make it part of my discussions in vetting potential play partners....
For both the submissive and dominant, knowing what your needs and wants are is a key thing (well, it is key in any relationship), one of the hard things is though, that some of the things that are your needs, you do not realize until you don't have 'that thing' anymore...
Needs and wants, everyone has them, and they all are valid, but being valid does not equal being safe, sane, smart, or attainable. I mean, I want to be a six foot, well endowed, multi-millionaire--- and if I win the lottery, I might get one of those things...
I hear all too often, some WannaDomaBe making the declaration to a submissive that "your needs are not important, MY needs will be your needs," and unfortunately, I have known a few subs that have gone off with someone like that, and had it end badly.
Our needs are ours and can never be totally relegated to the side without causing great amounts of stress and drama. Sometimes this stays internal and becomes depression, anger, resentment, low self-esteem, etc... or outward in fighting, drama, disobedience, etc...
Needs and wants are internal creations, someone else cannot dictate to a person what their needs and wants should be. Through enough discussion, browbeating or manipulation, a person can change their needs and wants for someone else, but unless it is a true shift, it will not last, and that person's needs are going to push back through.
I do not understand this attitude of picking any person and deciding that you want them to be your sub, and that you can twist and conform them to what you want. Personally, I have to take time to get to know the person, to see what their needs and wants are, and see how closely they match or are compatible to mine. Through this discussion and growth process, I have found people that have the want to see to my needs without subsuming the submissive's needs.
Needs and wants can at times run contrary to themselves as well. I have the need to remain healthy, I have the want to have unprotected sex because it is a lot more fun. In this case, the need outweighs the want, and I have protected sex. I use this example because I have heard many different subs talk about how a Dom does not want to have protected sex even though the submissive does, and that the submissive (at times) gets manipulated through that element of "My needs are yours" and "a good submissive does what they are told" and other bullshit. Even if the submissive wants to have good ol' bareback sex too, their need (and potential limit) of protected sex should be respected.
Another need element that I have come across is the need of time and attention. I know this is a big one for Poly people too... right now, I have a lot on my plate, both in the sense of everyday life, but also when it comes to play, I have a few different people that I play with. One thing that I discuss right up front is this element of not setting a specific schedule, not knowing how much time there is going to be for play etc, because short of finding someone with that spark, I know that play relationships end up taking a backseat when other life issues come up. If the person that I am talking to needs more than that, it is not going to work, for either of us, and I would rather not get started down that road to drama.
Touching back to the personal ethic/moral issue, and having read someone discuss the element of photos, the Dom wanting them and the sub not wanting them to be taken...
This is an area that I have had lots of experience with as I like photos, I have been asked why I want them, and I have realized that they are sort of like souvenirs of that play. I do like sharing them to some degree, but it is not so much about tossing them out there to say "Look what I did," as it is that visual element that I can go back and relive (and sometimes wank to) the moment. I have played with people that were total camera whores and loved it, to those that were of the 'no way no how' element. What it has come down to for me is, that it is not my body, reputation and livelihood that is at 'risk' with these pictures. I know, and play with a number of professional people that if it were know in the least that they were kinky, it could easily jeopardize their jobs. No matter how careful I am in handling the photos, shit happens... my computer could go in for repairs and the tech gets nosy, hell someone could steal it and for the fun of it start posting them. Hell, I had a friend who had a relative use their computer to send an email, found personal photos, and then tried to blackmail them... so shit does happen, and if a person does not want to run that risk (And yes, that is risk aware) then it doesn't happen. Now, that being said, I have discussed with individuals if there were anyway to make them feel safe, and me still get pics, and there have been some yeses, and some nos. and it is all good...
So ultimately, to answer the question, if the submissive has personal moral or ethical reasons for not wanting to do something, then no, it is not disobedient, and I would say that if whatever the "X" item that caused the contention is a major want/need for me... I need to make it part of my discussions in vetting potential play partners....
For both the submissive and dominant, knowing what your needs and wants are is a key thing (well, it is key in any relationship), one of the hard things is though, that some of the things that are your needs, you do not realize until you don't have 'that thing' anymore...
For more background on the photograph example and the discussion in general... I was chatting with a dom last night whom I have not yet met, and he mentioned that he requires his submissives to take photo, I don't know to prove their submission or something. I said that would absolutely never happen, as while I am not morally opposed to naughty pictures, I have an ethical issue. I teach personal branding and marketing and I council my clients to never have a bunch of digital information that they wouldn't want their grandma to see. So, as an ethical professional, how could I violate my beliefs. The Dom in question said that was outright disobedience and I'd be punished, if we were in a relationship. My response was "Well, you'll never get the pictures so I guess we'll never be in a relationship."
ReplyDelete@MutasakiTeapot - That is a fantastic response... I would say that if a Dom knew about an issue like that, that was an ethical or moralistic one, and still demanded you to do it... well, it is a clear case of setting a person up to fail, or pushing a person to violate their sense of self.
ReplyDeleteI just don't see D/s as being that much of a black & white, cookie cutter world....